Hawk Mountain Brown Course
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Topic created by rgbortz on Mon Mar 22, 2021 at 10:43 amGreat job with your first time as course setter Eric. All courses on Route Gadget look like they were set by an experienced setter. Plenty of challenge for the advanced course especially.Number 8 circle on the Brown course certainly is not in or next to thick rodedendron. Was it moved for subsequent runners ? Looking at the splits it appears there was a bit of a problem finding the control. That split should have been in the vicinity of 2 minutes. Conversation with other Brown runners indicated the control was not where the map led them to but some eventually bumped in to it.Most aren't that competitive and don't care and I may not either because I am still grateful for all the work put in to setting courses and putting on a event. However some still care that the results reflect an issue with any course.All-in-all the whole team did a spectacular job ! Thank You !
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Reply by alenka0000 on Mon Mar 22, 2021 at 2:03 pmRon,thank you very much for bringing this up, I too was trying to figure out how to best get people's opinions on this. I noticed an issue with control 8 on Brown when I was processing results: two very accurate orienteers who never mispunch missed that control, and all but 3 or 4 people lost a very significant amount of time on it.I didn't make it to the event, so my opinion certainly doesn't have too much substance under it. But looking at the numbers, I feel like it's rather unlikely that the control was in the right spot. What do other Brown runners think?My first reaction was to just fix the mispunches. But that would penalize all the people that doubted themselves, and instead of skipping #8 quickly, lost time wandering around and looking for it. Would it be better to void the two splits, to and from 8?thanks,-Lena
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Reply by ErikEddy on Mon Mar 22, 2021 at 2:36 pmtypically, you should void 7-8 and 8-9 for a local event.
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Reply by alenka0000 on Mon Mar 22, 2021 at 6:15 pmokay, if there are no objections, I'll void the two legs and re-post the resuts.-Lena
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Reply by alenka0000 on Mon Mar 22, 2021 at 8:28 pm
I voided splits 8 (64-49) and 9(49-32) from the Brown course. This removed the two mispunches (Ron Bortz and Janet Tryson), and shuffled the Brown results table a bit.
I also marked Kathy Urban's entry as DNS, since the 50 min on split 8 clearly ruined her course, and I thought it would be unfair for this DNF to count against her.
I could not find a way to void splits on Attackpoint. The MPs are taken care of, but the total times for all competitors, and the order of winners is incorrect. I added a note at the top about voided splits, but this is the best I could do.
-Lena
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Reply by Guy-O on Tue Mar 23, 2021 at 7:15 amThat reshuffling dropped me from 9th to 12th -- which is probably fair, as I was surprised to be in the top half, since I pretty much walked all of it -- and went through the dense-undergrowth + open-with-scattered-trees going 9 - 10 (32-50).As for #8, it seemed closer to the veg boundary / farther from the logged area than I expected, and was in a laurel patch, with high branches, which didn't seem to warrant a "FLO boulder", especially as there was a similar one nearby. Definitely rusty...
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Reply by kathyu on Tue Mar 23, 2021 at 9:15 amThis is going against the tide, but in a situation like this, I generally expect the scoring chips to fall where they may. As so often happens to me, I found #8 after deciding to give up and go for #9. I led at least one orienteer right into it. When you make adjustments, you leave the door open for future protests. We used to see this in car rallies all the time.But spending a huge amount of time on one control does not ruin a meet for me. What sent me back to start was the rocky route to #9 which, in my tired state, looked brutal.So this was a more challenging brown, especially compared to Tyler the previous week. This is one of the best things about orienteering -- it never fails to surprise and intrigue. Here's to the course setters whose work is always appreciated!PS I can't believe this was Eric's first time setting courses! Way to go Eric!
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Reply by alenka0000 on Tue Mar 23, 2021 at 10:00 amSorry, Kathy, I should have said #8 messed up your total time. That's what I meant, but used the wrong words. Lots of words on the page, some get jumbled up :) I do know something silly like this wouldn't ruin the experience for you! :)
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Reply by dmorgan on Tue Mar 23, 2021 at 10:06 amGeez...#8 on Brown was easy. After roaming around in the briars, you go back to the trail connection, set a bearing, pace count until you reach Kathy Urban, who takes you directly to the control!
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Reply by sfmones on Tue Mar 23, 2021 at 12:09 pmHi Kathy-I will be doing Brown at Ridley. Where will you be stationed?Steve
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Reply by kathyu on Tue Mar 23, 2021 at 7:01 pmha ha guys, very funny. Just listen for the 74 year old lady cursing a blue streak near those pesky elusive controls.
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Reply by Len on Wed Mar 24, 2021 at 11:39 amComming off a year with almost no orienteering and only a few weeks after foot surgery, I was just happy to be out in the woods. So. everything was a bit rusty. This would have been a difficult control regardless as I find it difficult to identify clearings sometimes. (I was looking for a clearing with a thicket inside it) My pace counts were off all day due to the map scale and my shorter stride so I chalked up the error to my impared skills. It did run through my mind that the actual location seemed further downhill than I expected... but I have been more wrong before.All in all, I enjoyed the course. There were some very nice control locations and it was just what I needed to start off 2021. Thank you for the time and effort in designing the courses.
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Reply by edscott on Wed Mar 24, 2021 at 10:10 pmYes I left #8 very confused. The only clearing I found was more a rough open patch with no green spot in the middle. Bailed out to the trail and tried again with no success, then while bailng for the second time found the control just hanging out in the woods. I think the control was in about the right area, but the map seemed a bit weak in that area. Otherwise no prolems and overall a great map.
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Reply by camperpat on Thu Mar 25, 2021 at 6:28 pmmaybe I should switch from. orange to brown. lol
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Reply by rgbortz on Thu Mar 25, 2021 at 8:55 pmSure would like to know where others thought the control was actually located. I talked to one runner that put it between the north south vegetation boundary and the north south dry ditch in the east edge of the green. As you can see from my route gadget post I attacked this control from 4 definit positions and still no control. Normally if I find a control that I am certain is not where it belongs and I am the first runner out I will verify , cross verify and verify again that I know exactly where it should be according to the drawn competition map and move it to the correct location before other runners get there but I never found the control in a wide open area and certainly was not going to amble around in a green area looking for it when the map says it's not in there. I did report my observance at the end of my run but I do not see any reports if it was determined to be at the wrong location and moved or if other people found it where they believe the map said it would be.
